Kim (00:01.27)
Hi, Laura, welcome. I'm really excited to have you here today.
Laura Goode (00:06.146)
Thank you so much. Thank you for suggesting this. I mean, never in a million years would I think I'd be recording a podcast to talk about my pelvic floor, but this is sort of a new adventure for me. So let's go.
Kim (00:18.554)
Yeah, well, you know, I applaud you for saying yes, first of all, I reached out to you because they're, they're
I have many people in my community and there are several that stand out who make the commitment, they're very vocal, you shared your wins. And one of the favorite ones I had was one of your earliest emails was, oh my God, I feel like I'm getting my PhD in pelvic health. And you were just, you couldn't, it's almost like you couldn't stop sending messages because you're like, oh my God, this is a light bulb, this is an aha moment, this is this. And I just, I was laughing along, not at you,
joyfully about all that you were learning and experiencing by going through the program. So I invited you on because I think there was so much power in women sharing their stories. And as you kind of you'll talk about your journey, but one part of it was you stumbled across me somehow on the internet and you came in and you learned and you're part of this community now and so many people struggle. They are sitting in silence. They're suffering. They don't know where to turn.
people, stories and voices from others who've been in their shoes is so powerful. So thank you so much for saying yes and for being here. So if we can start with what was your pelvic health background? What sort of led you down the path to finding me?
Laura Goode (01:45.426)
Absolutely. Well, thank you for having me. Just by way of background, I'm almost 63 on Friday, eight years post-menopause and I had a very easy...
menopause, I mean minimal symptoms, but became aware of something happening down there. You know, as I used to say, I didn't use the word vagina or vulva prior to getting to know you, but down there, you know, something was happening probably six or seven years ago. And the first time I even heard the term prolapse was during a pap test at a routine physical. And, you know, I asked what is this bulge? Like what exactly is it? What body part is it?
Kim (02:06.136)
Ha ha.
Laura Goode (02:26.608)
a female saying something like, yeah, you know, you've got a minor prolapse going on, but really didn't share any particular tips or anything further than that. But she said, you know, you probably should see a specialty surgeon who can quote unquote fix it. And you know, I was laughing to myself thinking, you know, when you're lying down, a prolapse is not a big deal. Like people have said, oh, well, does it affect you, you know, having sex? I'm like, no. It's out of the way when you're lying down.
And it's funny to me that a pelvic exam isn't done standing up because it's all, in my case, it's gravity. So, you know, I don't blame her for not educating me more. I don't think it was probably something that she ever learned about in med school or I think if I hadn't asked about what it was, I don't think she would have necessarily even mentioned it to me. So.
about eight months ago, it was bothering me to the point where, and I'll get into my symptoms in a second, but I went and I saw a urogynecologist who was Harvard trained and Mass General and, you know, all sorts of credentials who explained that I had a stage three vaginal cystosylo prolapse, erectosylo prolapse, and erectal prolapse. And I thought, hmm.
I had no idea what these terms even were. And he referred me to a colleague who was a colorectal surgeon. And after much in-depth testing, which is, I mean, if you think childbirth is embarrassing, I mean, this was like so embarrassing, these different tests, but I just went through the whole process. And I grew up in an age, I guess, where when I...
Kim (04:05.151)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Goode (04:11.03)
doctor tells you to do something or a surgeon recommends something. I mean, I just assume that well, then that's what I'm going to do. And he explained that this colorectal surgeon and he would do a tag team surgery for a cystoseal repair, erectocele repair, a bladder sling, erectopaxie, and most likely a hysterectomy.
So my first reaction was, sounds awfully serious and sounds very invasive and sounds kind of scary. What is this? And both surgeons said, we're confident that we can definitely provide some relief, but did warn that A, symptoms could return, and B, fixing one situation, the vaginal prolapse, could actually make the rectal prolapse worse. So I was confused, I was scared.
I just wasn't sure what I was getting into, but I thought, well, I can't really go on like this. I'm only 63, so.
I play a lot of golf. I like to go for long walks. So I would say my symptoms, is that helpful to share? For others, the bulge as I call it, which would be fine in the morning. And as the day went on, I mean, I couldn't really walk 18 holes of golf. Tennis, I would feel it. It didn't ever hurt, but it felt like
Kim (05:25.282)
Mm-hmm. Yes, please.
Laura Goode (05:44.994)
At its worst, you know, it feels like a baby is crowning in there. It feels like you have a bowling ball that wants to come out. It feels like you want to have the urge to put your fingers inside you and push it back up and hope it stays. The second symptom, which was a lot more embarrassing that I actually haven't had many women
that I've talked to about this, but fecal incontinence, which, you know, some days there would be no accidents, but some days there would be leakage, which was, it's just gross. I mean, it was that probably, when the surgeons asked me which bothers you more, I said, that does, because it's so gross. I mean, it's just, it's messy, and I just thought I cannot continue having this.
Kim (06:27.555)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Goode (06:33.374)
symptom. And then I've never had bladder incontinence, which you talked so much about with all of your various clients. And I think the only reason I don't is because the prolapse is in the way. I think it kind of blocks. And I know that from some of the testing that I had done prior to the surgery and whatnot. But there's definitely that feeling of when I'm in the bathroom, I can't rush. But there's a feeling of wanting to push down to really empty my bladder.
Kim (07:00.846)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Goode (07:01.166)
So thinking about surgery was super scary and overwhelming. And I just thought, okay, what should I do?
Kim (07:09.49)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and you know, like a few things that you've said there, coming back to your initial assessment with the speculum during a PAP, the challenge with those is usually they're, thankfully very quick, because nobody likes a PAP, but when the speculum goes in, it can push a bulge out of the way. So it's not always an accurate representation. And as you say, you're laying down, you're not upright, so that shifts things as well. And sometimes they will ask you to bear down.
Um, sometimes they keep asking, you know, keep bearing, keep bearing down. And I think that in and of itself, I think can be a bit disruptive. And if we just had people stand up, I think we'd get a fairly good representation as to what is happening. Um, and then, and the other is like the bulges, like that's what people talk about. It's just, it's uncomfortable. It's in the way it, and the classic symptom of it's fine in the morning and it gets worse as the day goes on. Like that is a classic.
Laura Goode (07:43.79)
Mm-hmm.
Kim (08:00.67)
presentation of or symptom of prolapse. And the incontinence piece, when we have a bulge, it can apply pressure against the urethral muscle. So incontinence is often there, but masked by the bulge. And a lot of people who don't go through the extensive testing and go straight to the surgery, they have their prolapse repair and now they have incontinence. And it's not that
They have traded one for the other per se. The other one was always there. It just was masked and it's ideal if somebody is going through surgery to have a pessary put in to see.
if there is any masked incontinence or not, and is that something that needs to be repaired at the same time? So it sounds like you had pretty extensive testing. And as you say, it's not super comfortable and fun to go through it. And a lot of people will not go through it simply because they find it uncomfortable. And so applaud you for being here, sharing your story, but also the fact that you have remained curious along the way and you have done the work.
Laura Goode (09:08.078)
So I actually did, while you're mentioning passere, actually, that was the first thing that was recommended to me when I went to see a physical therapist.
which I didn't even know PT physical therapy was a thing. And I remember thinking, I'm going to be the only one there. It's going to be so embarrassing, you know, the whole, and I'm not a super squeamish person, but when I walked into the physical therapy practice and then I realized there were over 20 pelvic floor physical therapists there, and there was a huge waiting room full of women and actually a few men, interestingly. But they were the ones that had suggested the pessary and it didn't work for me
of my anatomy or whatnot, it just fell out. So that was not an option for me. And I think that has worked for friends who have mentioned, you know, a similar prolapse situation but I think mine was a little more complex with things going on. I threw out my pelvic floor. But anyway, so how did I find, how did I find you? So.
Kim (09:54.722)
Mm-hmm.
Kim (10:03.862)
Yeah.
Kim (10:08.786)
Yeah.
Laura Goode (10:09.942)
Right about this time, I started doing a little bit of research online about what exactly these surgical procedures were. I mean, I didn't know the terminology whatsoever, and I could barely pronounce them, let alone imagining what was going on within my insides. So, as you all know, as everyone knows, once you start Googling one thing, pelvic floor surgery and prolapse, all of a sudden your social media is filled with products and services and...
Kim (10:31.234)
Yeah
Laura Goode (10:39.086)
kind of fascinating. I mean, it does, it is strange how the algorithms work, but I'm super grateful that I, you popped up on my feed. And I remember my first thought was she looks so nice. She looks, she sounds so smart. You know, what do I have to lose? I should just at least click on the vagina coach website and see what this is all about. But
You know, you have to be, I mean, you have to be so careful. I mean, I think people are cynical nowadays on social media in general, because there's a lot of junk out there. There's a lot of false claims of this and that. But I thought, I don't know, something just led me to say, she looks so nice, incredible and smart, and I'm gonna explore this. So before I knew it, I had signed up for Buff Muff and all the...
I jumped right in and signed up for all of your programs, particularly the one about, oh, so you're considering surgery? Here are some of the questions you should ask. And that, and we can talk about that, but that was hugely important because I didn't know what questions there even were to ask, let alone your checklist, which was super, super interesting. So.
Kim (11:55.614)
Yeah, yeah. It's funny that you, sorry before you go on, I have many messages every single day. If somebody's, if that first welcome email doesn't land in somebody's inbox, they will immediately write to us, is this a scam? I've been taken. I don't trust you. Like everybody, there's a, there's an innate sense of
I've been scammed and there's, I don't trust anybody. And I totally understand. And I want to immediately reply to those people and assure them that it's, I'm a real person. I'm not scamming you. You're absolutely going to get a ton of value, but it, but it is scary. The internet is scary because there are so many false claims and scams and, you know, challenges.
Laura Goode (12:41.262)
I feel like it's kind of restored my belief that there's a lot of really good stuff on there because When I think about okay, so I started the buff-muff program right away Your app is really easy to use and it's you know, it's ten minutes a day and your big thing is it's not just about Kegels I mean we all learned about Kegels when we were giving birth. I mean, I wish I mean again at my age
Kim (12:48.215)
Yeah.
Laura Goode (13:07.814)
no one ever mentioned anything about postpartum physical therapy. It wasn't even a thing. So I was fine chugging along up until menopause. I mean, the prolapse was probably there, but I think the loss of estrogen, and as I've just learned, as I've gone along, that gravity and muscle tone and all of that just changes as we, you know, as we age. But so, you know, the, the program itself, I mean, seemed easy to me. I mean, I'm physically really active. I've been going to the gym.
Kim (13:30.07)
Yep, yep.
Laura Goode (13:39.528)
I've done bridges and squats and all the kind of things that you talked about in Buff Muff, but I did not have at all a perception of what my pelvic floor was doing during this. And in fact, my breathing was...
Kim (13:56.504)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Goode (13:58.85)
backwards in terms of what my pelvic floor was doing during an inhale versus an exhale and some of your imagery about the blueberry and the you know the Octopus or whatever
Kim (14:10.958)
Jellyfish shouldn't. Yep.
Laura Goode (14:12.262)
Sometimes you need those cues to just kind of go, oh, I get it. And so what I've found is that now the exercises, I mean, I pretty much have them memorized, but now I'm just incorporating them into daily life. So that when I go to a yoga class, I mean, I'm in a child's pose, I can do some hyperpressive breathing. Well, actually it's kind of hard to do it there. Or when I'm doing a bridge, on my inhale, my exhale, I'm engaging my pelvic floor.
Kim (14:35.967)
Hahaha
Laura Goode (14:42.236)
way, way more than I used to. So, but it's a multi-pronged approach. You can't just say, oh, I'm going to do this 10 minutes and it's going to be fixed. So, I was really curious about, and what I learned from all of your great resources is that
Kim (14:44.342)
Yeah, yeah.
Laura Goode (15:01.09)
Yeah, you got to do these exercises and you can't let up. And I'll tell you in a second, a funny story about when I get head COVID and I coughed for weeks on end and what that did to my pelvic floor. But anyway, I think your recommendations beyond that have been.
Kim (15:09.994)
Yeah. Ha ha ha.
Laura Goode (15:19.206)
invaluable and I think it's hard to say oh it's the estrogen cream versus the v-fit but the combination of five things I think have gotten me from on a scale of one to ten with this being aggravating I was at a nine and a half and I'm probably at two you know three I mean it's there but it doesn't bother me in the same way that it used to so
Kim (15:42.038)
That's life changing.
Kim (15:47.434)
Yeah, yeah, that's huge. That is huge. And you are, you have currently, I think, canceled your surgeries, is that correct?
Laura Goode (15:55.902)
Yeah, that's, I mean, maybe someday I'm gonna need to do something, but if I can avoid it at all costs, I mean, I'm not a marathon runner. I'm not a competitive trampoline jumper. I mean, I don't do things that are gonna purposely aggravate it, but if my lifestyle of wanting to be able to play golf and some pickleball and go for a walk without feeling it,
Kim (15:58.55)
Not happening.
Kim (16:23.974)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, it's your quality of life. You got your quality of life back, that's huge.
Laura Goode (16:24.406)
then I'm good. I'm good.
Laura Goode (16:30.646)
But so in terms of in addition to the exercises, the estrogen cream has definitely been a game changer. And trust me, I mean, I was hesitant at first since there's so much misinformation of estrogen in general for post-menopausal women. And that's such a shame. I mean, I've learned from your colleague, Dr. Kelly Caspersen that...
Kim (16:43.022)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Goode (16:51.834)
She is, if anyone needs another great podcast, hers is hers is fantastic. She says all women should be using estrogen cream until the day they die. I mean, the one thing that my surgeon did prescribe leading up to my surgery was estrogen cream, since he could tell immediately that, you know, my tissues, they were not pink, they were not supple. You know, they were they were worn out. I don't know, but.
Kim (16:56.43)
She's amazing.
Laura Goode (17:18.034)
So I started that immediately through the surgeon. And it's a prescription, but I think that has helped immensely. But I'd say 75% of my friends who I've discussed this topic with, has said, oh, I can't do estrogen. My mom had breast cancer, or I can't do estrogen because of this family history with cancer. And I'm not an expert, but what I have learned is that it's very different than systemic.
estrogen and that it is such a low dose in perspective and in terms of its absorption into your bloodstream, correct? Am I correct in saying that?
Kim (17:58.174)
A thousand percent, yeah. And I will, I'm actually in the process of writing an article about vaginal estrogen because I say, I preach.
vaginal estrogen like an essential nutrient almost, and there is a lot of misconception. But I do direct to people like Dr. Kelly Casperson, Dr. Rachel Rubin, Dr. Corrine Men. Dr. Corrine Men is a breast cancer survivor herself, and she's lately definitely on a mission of increasing awareness about...
Laura Goode (18:18.702)
Mm-hmm.
Kim (18:29.434)
hormone therapy vaginal as well as systemic for people with a history of breast cancer and specific to vaginal estrogen which is what we're talking about here this is estrogen applied locally inside and the surround to the surrounding tissues of the vulva and the labia and around the clitoris.
there and actually sidebar Dr. Karin Mann also recently interviewed Dr. Avram Blooming who's one of the co-authors of estrogen matters. He came onto her Instagram page and they were talking specifically about vaginal estrogen also as it relates to cancer and one recent study they were referencing has shown no increased risk of breast cancer recurrence with people using local vaginal
Laura Goode (18:58.306)
Mm-hmm.
Kim (19:17.4)
research that comes out to support that. So something to speak to your oncologist about, do your research, look at menopause.org for the most recent position statement and also the physicians that we have referenced here are also very evidence informed, many of which also have their own life history experience with it as well.
Laura Goode (19:33.492)
I'm back.
I do think, I mean I have a question for you because it comes in the tiny little tablet and then the tube of cream. And the little tablet is obviously a lot less messy and just easy, you just pop it right in there. But what I've been doing is doing that and then just using a little bit of cream.
just around the surrounding tissues. Because it sort of feels like if that little tiny pellet is way up top, is it ever going to do anything? As opposed to an entire squirt of the cream. And then it just reminds me of like different things.
Kim (19:59.018)
Yeah, that's a great strategy.
Kim (20:03.373)
Right.
Kim (20:12.254)
Yeah, and it's personal preference really. Like the tablet is, as you say, it's inserted and a little bit of it will kind of seep down as you're sleeping. But applying cream locally, externally is super, super helpful and beneficial. And really, like I would say it's pretty hard to use too much. And there's also different forms of estrogen. So there's the tablet and many of the creams are estradiol which is a stronger form.
Laura Goode (20:28.991)
Yeah, so.
Laura Goode (20:41.363)
what I'm doing.
Kim (20:42.588)
And there's also Estriol, which some people will use as the external cream. There's also Bi-Est, which is a combination of Estradial and Estriol. So it gets really quite nuanced. And when you're working with a practitioner who is well informed, you can go through the process of finding what is the best for you based on the messiness, the not messiness, the application, using an applicator versus a finger, which tissues are the most irritated.
So many people will say that right at the opening, those tissues right at the kind of the base of the opening are often the ones that are the most painful or the most irritated. And when we put our vaginal estrogen in, it's about the first two thirds-ish of the vagina. It doesn't need to be plunged all the way up to the very top. And focusing a little bit more around that opening can be really helpful.
Laura Goode (21:36.99)
Well, exactly, because the majority of friends that I've discussed this topic at all with, they complained about, and the ones I've referred to you is the bladder incontinence, you know, the, you know, anyway, secondly, the painful sex. And those are two things that I haven't had any issue with whatsoever. So it just shows that there's so many different ways that a lack of estrogen is going to manifest itself. But...
Kim (21:50.999)
Yep.
Yep.
Kim (22:05.834)
Right, right, yeah.
Laura Goode (22:06.694)
Anyway, the other thing in addition to the estrogen is a good moisturizer. And Kelly's the one who says, you know, women spend thousands of dollars on moisturizers for their face. Why on earth are we not moisturizing the, you know, this area of our body? So.
Kim (22:16.075)
Yeah.
Kim (22:21.346)
Yep.
Laura Goode (22:22.794)
You know, and it's very different than a KY jelly that, you know, makes sex easier. I mean, these are true moisturizers. So the Jalva product and the Feel Amazing are just part of my, you know, weekly routine. I sort of do those on the days I'm not doing it.
Kim (22:37.43)
Yeah, yeah, and Java.
Yeah, and, and Jalva, another one of my favorite products, and this is available over the counter, which is helpful because some people don't, they don't have a provider that they can get the prescription for the estrogen for. And, and Jalva is a vaginal DHEA made by Dr. Anna Kabeca, who I also love. And it's some people will use their estrogen and vaginal DHEA like a Jalva. Some people use just DHEA, some people use just estrogen.
when you work with a knowledgeable practitioner and you can go through those nuances and find what's best for you and what helps you manage your symptoms. Cause it's just like Kegels aren't the answer to every pelvic floor or incontinence prolapse problem. You know, a estrogen tablet is not always going to be the best for an individual person as well. So there's lots of ways that we can tweak that.
Laura Goode (23:33.41)
Mm-hmm, exactly. And then the V-Fit, I mean, this was sort of a splurge and I figured with the amount that I was gonna be spending ultimately on surgery, co-pays and follow-up doctors visits, I thought, you know, it's worth trying. And again, it's hard to say, oh, that's made the biggest difference or the estrogen, it doesn't matter, it's all together. So I do that a couple of days a week, like you say, you know, it's, it's.
easy and I read my book and it does its thing and it's got an app attached to my phone. I do my 10 minutes and hopefully the red light you can describe it in a little bit more detail to your listeners but what exactly it is but red light.
Kim (24:09.079)
Yes. Yep.
Kim (24:13.47)
Yep. Yeah, the V-Fit is... Yeah, I'm a huge fan of...
of red light therapy and they had approached me, this is way back when I used to have an e-commerce store with pelvic health products and they had approached me because I was in Canada and they said we'd like to get this product into Canada and I had a medical device establishment license so I could sell these and that and I didn't really know anything and I was a little, you know, I've never heard of red light therapy and red light therapy in the vagina and you know, I need to do a lot of research but there thankfully was a
Laura Goode (24:23.628)
Uh huh.
Kim (24:52.272)
And I also have to use and try everything before I promote it. So I've got one and I was using it and I absolutely loved it. Still love it to this day. It's one of my I think it is my favorite pelvic floor device, but it uses red light therapy, which red light therapy is helpful for so many things in our body and but especially with tissue support tissue healing tissue regeneration collagen elastin production. There's also infrared.
Laura Goode (25:06.24)
I'm going to.
Laura Goode (25:20.875)
Okay.
Kim (25:22.032)
heat which helps with that as well and is quite soothing and it also has sonic vibration which can elicit relaxation response but also if you were to do pelvic floor activation like your core breath with the vibration on it can elicit a little bit more stimulation or activation of the muscle fibers as well so it's really a it's a pretty multifaceted device that can help with symptoms of prolapse and incontinence but it can also help with vaginal dryness and that thinning
the tissue issues that we have when we are approaching or moving beyond menopause.
Laura Goode (25:56.618)
Mm-hmm. Exactly. And then last, I have found taking gluten out of my diet. I knew gluten bothered me, but I hadn't had, I didn't put two and two together. The less I strain in the bathroom, the better off I am. So now I'm like a stereotypical man who has my book and my magazine in the bathroom. Like, I don't rush. You know, I don't strain, and that has paid off a lot.
Kim (26:25.386)
Yeah, yeah, that's huge, that's huge.
Laura Goode (26:26.746)
So, because the less I, yeah, the less I push, the better off I am. So, you know, I think your community... Oh, go ahead.
Kim (26:31.608)
Yep.
So where are you?
Sorry, I was just gonna say, so you've embraced the approach. You were doing buff muff, you're doing the hyper presses, you were taking it a lot into consideration about the lifestyle. You're now at this point here and I think you were just gonna start and I was sort of interrupting you there. But the other piece that you came onto a lot of the group coaching calls and so tell us your experience there.
Laura Goode (26:59.735)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Goode (27:03.17)
Well, I have to say, I mean, it was so empowering when I started the program to have interaction with other women in similar situations, because truly, aside from seeing people in the waiting room when I went for my PT sessions, I never really talked about it, even with good friends. I mean, it felt...
I mean, I'm not a squeamish person, but it just wasn't a topic that would typically come up. And now I'm like the poster child first. So how's your pelvic floor? But just to realize that you're not alone and how many of us have been told, well, it's just what happens when we get to our age or you just have to live with it. And that, I mean, when you look at the aisles of the supermarket where all the...
you know, depends are. And, you know, these women wearing, you know, pee pads, like whatever, like that is actually, that's just such a bandaid and that's not, that's not the solution. So the Zoom calls were great. I mean, my, and the reason I'm doing this today is not that I love necessarily putting myself out there to talk about all this with so many people, except that my favorite part of my...
experience with you has been hearing other people's stories. And on these Zoom calls, you've got, you know, you've got all these faces and all these women at different ages. So they're not all just like me. I mean, some are postpartum and whoever told them that not only is having an infant heart, but yeah, when your insides feel like they're falling out, like,
Kim (28:35.182)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Goode (28:35.81)
There's a lot more information out there today than in my day. So that was a real plus. But as I said earlier, you have to stay with it because, so I had COVID in December. It lasted for a lot longer than I expected. And I coughed and I coughed and I coughed. And I also felt lousy, so I didn't do many of my exercises. And guess what? Bottom line, my symptoms came.
you know, sort of roaring back. So it's almost like anything else when you set your mind, okay, I'm gonna do this amount of exercise. It's a lifestyle and it's something that I need to just be committed to for the longterm. So it was just sort of a reminder that.
Kim (29:02.414)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Goode (29:21.566)
This is something that is not super time consuming, but is important. It was the same as saying, I'm gonna stand on one leg while I brush my teeth, to work on my balance. But it is something that we just have to stay up on.
Kim (29:21.623)
Yeah.
Kim (29:29.974)
Yep.
Yep.
Kim (29:38.154)
Yeah, yeah, and I mean, you said brushing your teeth and I always am referencing.
dentists and our oral health because we were told at a very young age, the importance of brushing and flossing and going to see the dentist once or twice a year for a checkup. And we go for that checkup religiously. And we go, even if we don't have any issues or problems and they give us our checkup and they give us a clean bill of health. And that doesn't mean that, okay, great. I never have to brush or floss again. That means keep up with what you're doing and come back again. And if we had that same
Laura Goode (29:56.419)
Wait.
Laura Goode (30:06.233)
Exactly.
Kim (30:10.746)
If that was stressed to us when we were younger about the importance of our pelvic floor, the importance of pelvic floor exercise, pelvic floor physical therapy once a year, even if you have no symptoms and especially if you do, then it would change this whole landscape around the shame and the suffering and silence and the lack of information that so many women experience.
Laura Goode (30:37.03)
Exactly. So I'm not sure. I mean, you're a perfect example of somebody who knows infinitely more than any of the rest of us about this and you ended up actually having to have surgery. And you know, so all of this has helped me a great, great deal. I can't say that I'm never going to have to have surgery, but I feel infinitely more educated and empowered because
Like they always say, you need to advocate for yourself, whatever the health situation is. But I would encourage anyone who's even remotely been told that surgery is in their future or thinking this is not something that I can live with, or maybe they are the marathon runner and they say, well, I can't do that with this prolapse, so I am going to get that fixed. Your program about contemplating surgery, post-surgery, getting ready for surgery, and questions to ask.
Kim (31:21.454)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Goode (31:35.226)
That was equally, if not more valuable to me because I put together that list and I have it in my computer so that, you know, maybe it's 10 years down the road, I don't know, but I will be a much more educated patient as opposed to, oh, you were the one who said on the Zoom call when I said, yeah, the surgeon said while I'm at it, I think it would be easier to take out your uterus too.
Kim (31:53.366)
Yeah, and you're.
Laura Goode (32:05.094)
And you said to me, he said, easier for who? And I thought, no kidding. Yeah, it was easier for the surgeon because I don't know how everything is connected or what they connect it to or connect that to, but I'm not so sure easier for me, right? Anyway, I'll remember that. That's why you had. So.
Kim (32:16.078)
takes that out of the way. Yeah, yeah.
Kim (32:23.89)
Yep, yep, yeah, yeah.
Kim (32:29.286)
Yeah, and you know, when I was going through...
So going through the decision to have surgery, I really struggled because I felt like a hypocrite and I felt the shame and the embarrassment and all the things that I knew everybody that had ever talked to me about surgery before or had contemplated it silently was experiencing. And then I found the power in that and made the decision that was best for my body and decided to share it with everybody. And out of this fear that everybody would stop
you know, listening to whatever I was preaching. They came more and they also then had this other resource. And so the point that I wanna make here is there is no shame in surgery. And even if you choose down the road to have surgery, all of this work that you have done, all of the knowledge that you have will...
Laura Goode (33:05.963)
Right.
Kim (33:23.458)
provide a better experience and a better outcome. And there was another person who I follow who I absolutely adore is JJ Virgin. And she is a strength and conditioning specialist. And she's been a guru for many, many years. And she said in a podcast recently, she was talking about preparing her body for surgery. She was training for surgery, not pelvic surgery. It was, I forget which one it was. It might've been a knee injury or I don't remember. But anyway, regardless, she was talking about the importance. She's always talking about the importance
of muscle and balance and strength and building the resilience in this body so that when we face struggles like COVID or like a surgery or whatever it is, we can during that downtime when we aren't exercising, we don't.
take as many steps back and we can recover more quickly. And we use, so pelvic surgery is the same. Let's get the pelvic floor and the whole body in the best shape possible so that when we undergo this sort of chosen controlled trauma, we are in the best shape possible ahead of time. And then we know what to do and have the tools afterwards. And as you've already stated, it's not like, okay, now I have his surgery. Now I don't need to brush my teeth.
Right? Oh, now that I've had my root canal or my whatever it is, I don't need to do this anymore. No, absolutely not. You needed, I would argue, even more because we now have some scar tissue to contemplate and we have, you know, some, so we have to optimize that function. And anyway, you're a poster child, as you say, for
Laura Goode (34:43.48)
Yeah.
Kim (35:01.862)
somebody not accepting that and being curious and finding and trying and being brave and also making the commitment to themselves and I absolutely applaud you and also am so grateful for you sharing your story with others.
Laura Goode (35:17.75)
Well, thank you. Thank you. It gets easier to talk about the more, it's like practice like anything else. I literally, I mean, I don't think I had used the V word like practically in my life. Like why do women call it the JJ or, like no one even, I mean, Volvo especially, but vagina, you know, vagina monologues and, but I, people say, oh, why did she call her business a vagina coach? I said,
Kim (35:27.576)
Yeah.
Kim (35:32.386)
Yep.
Kim (35:39.551)
Yeah.
Laura Goode (35:45.302)
to normalize it because it's a body part. And remember saying, you know, that women typically wait years before they necessarily see a specialist about what's going on because they're conditioned to think it's just normal or, or no, it's not normal, but it's, it's the way it is versus a man who would probably go to the urologist in, you know, two days if something was not working. So my advice is talk about this stuff with friends and
Kim (36:07.926)
Yep.
Laura Goode (36:15.318)
seek out, I mean, I know you're in Canada, right? Is your Canadian, is that right? You know, it's really easy around here. I'm in the Boston area and in Florida. It's really easy to find pelvic floor physical therapists. It's not.
Kim (36:19.606)
Yes.
Laura Goode (36:29.77)
I mean, you might have to wait a little while to get in, but it's not uncommon whatsoever. But I love that analogy of the dentist. I can't think of more than one or two people I know who've ever been to one. And I think it should become sort of a standard thing. Find out what's going on inside your body so you don't get to the point where you need surgery because it's only at stage one, so you actually can do something about it. Seek out, you know, don't be skeptical about social media because I have to say, I wouldn't have...
gotten to this point without Instagram and listening to Between Two Lips, which is yours, and then You're Not Broken with Kelly Casperson. I mean, those are my two favorite podcasts out there. And I listen to every single one of your episodes and whether it applies to me or not, I've learned something. So yeah, it's kind of a weirdly fun journey.
Kim (37:22.304)
I love it.
Kim (37:28.235)
Yeah, well, thank you. I, as I said, I'm very, very grateful. And I know that everybody listening is going to, is going to feel the same. That there, I'm proud of you for standing up. And on behalf of all women who deserve this information much earlier in life, thank you so much for sharing your experience with us.
Laura Goode (37:45.514)
You are so welcome. This was fun.
